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To: dan@engrg.uwo.ca (Dan Corrin), bfwong@ocf.berkeley.edu (Raven Blackburn),
        anthony@cs.pitt.edu (Michael Anthony Kapolka),
        mcknight@f104.n170.z1.fidonet.org (Chuck McKnight),
        fantasci!traveller@engrg.uwo.ca (Joseph "Jo" E Poplawski),
        jamesp@metolius.wr.tek.com (James T. Perkins)
Subject: TML Bundle #272: Msgs 3282-3297
Reply-To: traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com (TML Administrator)
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Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 21:00:37 PST
From: James T Perkins <jamesp@metolius.wr.tek.com>
Status: R


TML Bundles come from the archives of the Traveller Mailing List,
maintained by James Perkins, traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed Dec 11 21:00:33 PST 1991
From: traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com (TML Administrator)
Subject: TML Bundle #272: Table of Contents

-AMN- --Date--- --Sender--------- --Subject-----------------------------------
3283  10-Dec-91 surman@zulu.lgs.l Re: (3273) Trade and Commerce << Rob Dean bro
3284  10-Dec-91 bonnevil@stolaf.e Re: A Little Joke (Agility) << This little dr
3285  10-Dec-91 mccord@equinox.un Technical question... << Here's something I t
3286  06-Dec-91 Adam Naylor       Re: General Traveller Questions << [Forwarded
3287  08-Dec-91 Adam Naylor       Re: General Traveller Questions << [Forwarded
3288  07-Dec-91 Adam Naylor       Re: General Traveller Questions << [Forwarded
3289  10-Dec-91 James T Perkins   Re: General Traveller Questions << I skipped 
3290  10-Dec-91 James T Perkins   New sector data location << Brian G. Vaughan 
3291  10-Dec-91 KELLOGG@ducvax.au Flying in Circles << Hi, Flying in circles to
3292  11-Dec-91 Mike.Metlay@ORGAN Just when you thought it was safe to read the
3293  11-Dec-91 Mike.Metlay@ORGAN Edmund's Looking for ME?! AAAGH! I'M NOT HERE
3294  11-Dec-91 d9bertil@dtek.cha An E-tribe called TML << I hope nobody takes 
3295  11-Dec-91 bonnevil@stolaf.e Re: Misc. Questions... << just a couple tidbi
3296  11-Dec-91 TML Administrator Re: (3288) Re: General Traveller Questions <<
3297  11-Dec-91 James T Perkins   Re: Traveller (Again but not for long) << Ada
3298  11-Dec-91 TML Administrator TML Admin Deluged << For some people of late 

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3283
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 91 10:00:43 CST
From: surman@zulu.lgs.lsu.edu (Michael A. Surman)
Subject: Re: (3273) Trade and Commerce

Rob Dean brought up a topic that I find frustrating. Trade and
commerce. RPG's  don't explain it very well and sf authors don't
write about either (except for a few, of which Jack Vance's Demon
Princes novels offer one of the better explanations but only for
money not credit).

How is credit handled? Credit cards would present major problems
outside of a star system. Who would honor them? Granted the megacor-
porations would have a system for their employees but what about the
average citizen or player characters. Once you've mustered out you're
on your own. I still have problems with the retirement pay. There is
no way to keep track of payments from one system to another.

The same for paying the notes on a starship. What prevents anyone from
saying that they paid their note at their last stop a jump or 2 away.
By the time they could check it out the ship could be gone. Or the
simple fact of a late payment. At the time and distances involved
minor mistakes could have major repercussions.

Well, anyway here's some of my comments on Rob's posting.

> Would we agree that the purpose of a trade system is to allow the
> referee to put enough money into a game to allow the players to 
> maintain their own starship? 

I wouldn't say this. The trade system is an important part of the
economics of the system. Businesses look at cash flow. When money,
goods & services exchange hands that's when profits are made. The more
money introduced from outside the system the greater the chances of
profit.

> In order to design a new system, I think that it would be necessary to 
> set the background with some decisions about Imperial economics.

Definitely. Now how do we do it? Designing the basic mechanics of a
game is relatively easy. It's the background info that requires
detailed research.

> Are planets mostly self-sufficient?  

I think they are. However, since there are higher tech level planets
they would need to import the higher tech level goods to support the
high tech level starships that visit and to raise the general tech
level of the planet. Generally the higher the tech level the better
the living conditions so lower level planets would want to become
like their higher level counterparts.

Actually, that needs to be modified a bit. Established planets would
be mostly self sufficient. The newly colonized or mining worlds would
be highly dependent on outside sources because the industrial base
is not yet complete.

> Do 'balance of trade' issues affect individual merchants by making it 
> difficult to sell things on backwater worlds with few trade connections 
> to gain Imperial money? 

Backwater worlds would probably be happy they get visited by starships
and would buy everything they could afford. Most sf literature is
written under this assumption. These planets are not profitable for
the big outfits but are for the little guys, the 'typical' tramp
freighter ships that have lower overhead.
 
> Do the megacorporations tie up all of the steady trade in items with
> very high profit margins, leaving only occasional deals of this sort
> for the little guys? 

I would think this depends upon the particular items and the quantity
involved. If a market produced only a small quantity of something it
probably wouldn't be worth it even if it was very profitable (Piper's
Cosmic Computer novel had a planet that produced brandy that was
very expensive on Terra but they could only sell it to the infrequent
ships that passed through the system and then at a very reduced rate.
They also salvaged military equipment but again couldn't sell it for
what it was worth.)

> Do planets  routinely pass trade-restricting (or trade enhancing)
> legislation?

I think this would depend upon the government type. A Dictatorship
would want to keep the populace ignorant so would enforce strong
import conditions (i.e. keeping all the high tech goods for its own
use).
A more liberal govenment would want to better the conditions of its
citizens and would be probably have less severe import conditions.
But even in this type of system imports would be monitored so as to
lessen the impact upon society.

> I think the answers to all of these questions are probably 'yes', 
> but we've never been told so explicitly.

I'll agree with this. I have yet to see a good explanation anywhere
on trade and commerce.

> I think it would also be very nice to get some idea of the volume of
> shipping available in various regions of the Imperium...

I would probably say it is very similar to the conditions today.
Heavy traffic through the main trade routes by the everyone with 
lighter traffic to the outlying regions by small subsidiaries or
small independents.
Look at any major city. Planes, for instance. Every airline in the area
has flights into the city so connections can be made. But only the
small airlines service the smaller regional airports.

To pin down actual numbers would take some time. But even in the 
Imperium scheduled flights would be an integral component of
communications.

Since there would be frequent flights, one per day per major planet
for the major lines might be appropriate, would necessitate cheaper
travel costs. Travel costs, as they are now, seem to be too high.
Which is another point I find irritating. I would think that the
average or at least the above average citizen would want to take
a cruise offplanet. As it is now it would take a major portion of
a citizens income just for the ticket! 

Mike Surman



------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3284
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 91 10:21:54 GMT-0600
From: bonnevil@stolaf.edu
Subject: Re:  A Little Joke (Agility)


This little drone with the massive agility and supposedly no propulsion
unit doesn't make sense, though.  To be able to dodge, the craft will need
to be able to apply a thrust in some direction, right?  In zero g, unless
a counter-force is applied, the craft will continue to move on its new
vector caused by this thrust, due to inertia.  To be really agile, the
ship would have to be able to make many such dodging motions quickly,
perhaps even repetitively.  If it did repetitive dodges in the same
direction, thrusting the same way again and again, couldn't the vessel
be considered to be applying a maneuvering thrust?  It would probably be
higher than the thrust caused by the Challenge #45 ion drive....

Someone mentioned making fusion rockets less maneuverable than thrusters,
but allowing them a greater acceleration.  What if someone mounts BOTH
systems on their ship?  I had a vargr corsair captain in a campaign that
wanted to do this to his ship -- he liked the thought of having a backup
engine system that could be used for emergency power and a little extra kick
in an emergency.

The comment was made that fusion rockets couldn't be used for high-gee
agility because they couldn't provide "sideways" thrust without blowing up.
But what is to stop people from mounting secondary rockets on the hull
perpendicular to the main axis of thrust?  That rocket, perhaps a quarter
the size of the main engine, could be used in order to augment "sideways"
motion as well.  Maybe I'm missing something here.

- --Steve

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3285
From: mccord@equinox.unr.edu (Travis McCord)
Subject: Technical question...
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 91 15:25:21 GMT


Here's something I thought about after reading the Starship
Ops Manual...

OK, it says the jump drive generates this enormous amount of
energy, and sends it to the Lanthanum hull net, where just
the flowing of energy is enough to tear a hole in our dimension
and enter jumpspace.

Question: how does all that energy get from the drive to the hull 
without mangling space inside the ship?

Come to think of it, how does it manage to flow through the net 
without vaporizing it, the hull or the entire ship?  If there's
any resistance, the heat would be enormous, and if not, it would
be impossible to direct, wouldn't it?  (OK, I stank in physics.
Maybe some physicist/MegaTrav-fanatic could tell us all how the
Jump Drive is built.  :)

                                        --mccord@equinox.unr.edu
                                          former lurker


------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3286
From: Adam Naylor <anaylor@gara.une.oz.au>
Subject: Re: General Traveller Questions
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 91 15:00:02 EST

[Forwarded to TML.  Please respond to both TML and directly to Edmund's
mailbox -- James]

Oooooohhhhhh Boy !!!!!

I bet you thout you had heard the last of me (HAH!) I know when I am onto
a good thing .

Question 1

Can you give me an extended description of planetary governments 

Question 2

The vilani / vargr and solomani / aslan books wont be ordered by my book
store cause they suck 

So I dont suppose you have (very brief so as not to piss you off) any info
regarding of character generation of vargr and aslan 

Question 3

If your world is in a habitible zone and is the moon of a gas giant, you run a
a GREAT risk of having neighbours with twice the population of the homeworld

Question 4 

The moon sizes for another planets seem  a little wierd . I mean according
to those rules there is NO WAY the moon (ours) can be the sixe it is .

Question 5

If a world is both atmos 4-9 and a pop of 8+ it runs a HUGE RISK of being
near a dwarf star which actually makes it uninhabitible . 

Well outer zoned anyway .

Question 6

Are nuclear weapons illegal for everybody

Question 7

When does the imperium interfere in a member worlds affairs . So like when
the mysterious strike assignment from the naval characters generation comes 
into it . 

Question 8

Wouldnt a naval tech have a good chance of gaining the admin skill ?

Question 9 

Does an aslan male character whose social is about 6+ usually join the armed
forces 

Question 10 

I hope you are not getting sick of all these BLOODY NIGLEY QUESTIONS 

Question 11

Whose the guy who regards himself as an expert on military affairs in 
traveller (as in the one who has access to email)

Question 12

It took me an average 5 hours to make up a vehicle . How does Scott Kellog 
find the time, I mean geez .....

Question 13 

The power (in megawatts) in the vehicle creation system is really unclear ....
I dont suppose you have a clearer definition . 

Question 14

I tried to make a scout vessel (as the one from the encyclopedia) and
absolutly nothing was acurate . As it turned out the power listed for vessels
in the encyclopedia were on average 3 times the power I worked out for them

Question 15

How different is the robot rules in book 8 different from the ones published
in 79 in the best of traveller journal . (Which I have a copy)

Question 16

Thanks for ALL your help, I mean THANKS . I have been sitting in the dark
about MT for the past 2 years . 

Edmund



------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3287
From: Adam Naylor <anaylor@gara.une.oz.au>
Subject: Re: General Traveller Questions
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 91 19:57:39 EST

[Forwarded to TML.  Please respond to both TML and directly to Edmund's
mailbox -- James]

Okay I have some more .....

What does exactly NOE mean ???

What do the naval assignments mean


And what is going to happen to MT in 92 . 

The arcives (which I have  been cruising seem to be all fired up about it)

Star Vikings, based on Pipers space vikings ???

Edmund


------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3288
From: Adam Naylor <anaylor@gara.une.oz.au>
Subject: Re: General Traveller Questions
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 91 15:57:49 EST

[Forwarded to TML.  Please respond to both TML and directly to Edmund's
mailbox -- James]

Guess what !!!!!

I though of some more wonderful questions .......

Okay are you ready ....

1) Officers get promoted once a term, and not dependant on assignments (
except say garrison . So an army lieut gets promoted on an internal sec)

2) College : 4 yours at college to recieve a pidling extra educ points . How
about instead of gaining educ points, gain levels of academic . So a character
could have studied history, or genetics or something like that at college . 

3) Flight School : Is this one year or 4 . Could you spend brownie points
to gain extra pilot skills, The descriptions and tables seem to be different
from each other for advanced characters (I mean in naval academy, flight 
school etc) 

4) Traveller Aid Society . The description in the book isnt all that clear ...
Do travellers members pay for accomodation while travelling, How do they prove
thier identity as a traveller member . 

5) Naval Bases and Scout Bases

How big is a naval base (very roughly, like how many ships etc) 
How big is a scout base (as above)

Do the staff at bases count as members of the population 

6) Non Imperial Military Bases : What exactly are they ????

7) Do you know where I could pick up info about merc companies

8) What exactly are the official guidelines for vehicle creation . It 
seemed that all the creators in the archives (well the bundles) had thier own
idea

9) How far out are the vehicles in the encyclopedia from the truth ?

10) What is mike metlay (???)'s email address . I would like to ask him a 
few questions ?????

11) Geez I hope you arnt getting sick of me .....

Edmund


------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3289
Subject: Re: General Traveller Questions 
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 91 15:43:26 PST
From: James T Perkins <jamesp@metolius.WR>


I skipped the source-related questions as I haven't got my sources
with me.

Adam Naylor <anaylor@gara.une.oz.au> writes:
> If a world is both atmos 4-9 and a pop of 8+ it runs a HUGE RISK of being
> near a dwarf star which actually makes it uninhabitible.

Yep!  This problem has been around since Book 6.  I just treat the
basic system generation as gospel and the expanded as a suggestion
which I discard :-)

> Are nuclear weapons illegal for everybody
In the Imperium they are (it's a high crime to possess or sell one).
Only the Imperial armed forces have nukes and they only use them in cases
of extreme injustice.

> When does the imperium interfere in a member worlds affairs.  So like when
> the mysterious strike assignment from the naval characters generation comes
> into it.

Only when interstellar trade and commerce is grossly affected, or a
violation of imperial law (like use of nukes) is involved.

> I hope you are not getting sick of all these BLOODY NIGLEY QUESTIONS

Yes! :-)

> Whose the guy who regards himself as an expert on military affairs in
> traveller (as in the one who has access to email)

There are a few.  Like maybe Rob Dean?  I let them speak for
themselves.

> It took me an average 5 hours to make up a vehicle.  How does Scott Kellog
> find the time, I mean geez.....

I think they rework existing designs a great deal.  I agree it's a
formidable task (uncertain)

> Thanks for ALL your help, I mean THANKS.  I have been sitting in the dark
> about MT for the past 2 years.

I try.  Sorry for the spotty answers.

James
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Traveller Mailing List Administrator	     James T Perkins @ Tektronix, Inc
traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com	     Beaverton, Oregon, USA
    "How many ancients can dance on the head of a pin?" - Scott Kellogg

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3290
Subject: New sector data location
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 91 15:50:34 PST
From: James T Perkins <jamesp@metolius.WR>


Brian G. Vaughan <bvaughan@ocf.Berkeley.EDU> writes:
> Oh, and one other question: I understand there is a relatively new, updated
> collection of sector data files on one of the TML repositories.  Which one?

That's on sunbane [129.100.100.12], in (I think) directory
pub/traveller/sectors/dgp.updated
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Traveller Mailing List Administrator	     James T Perkins @ Tektronix, Inc
traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com	     Beaverton, Oregon, USA
    "How many ancients can dance on the head of a pin?" - Scott Kellogg

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3291
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1991 20:43 CDT
From: KELLOGG@ducvax.auburn.edu
Subject: Flying in Circles

Hi,

Flying in circles to simulate gravity

Ok, This is assuming that when the ship is accelerating @1G, the floor
is set up so that the crew feels 1G of acceleration on the aft bulkhead
making that the 'Floor'.  So, flying from planet to planet, you would
walk around on the 'floor' and feel perfectly normal.

Now, we want to stay in orbit, or just stay in one location.  By putting
a slow rotation on the ship you are pointing the drives in a varying
direction.  When you have made a full circle, your net acceleration is
zero.  Thus you haven't moved anywhere.

Well Tony, I did say a SLOW rotation now didn't I?  Acutally, I was
considering flying in a circle say... a couple kilometers in diameter...
I'm too lazy to figure out what the coliosis forces would do, but if
1 km is too small, then 2 km should be ok.

Think about it like this:  1kg Bead on a string.  whirl the bead around over
your head so that the bead is feeling 9.8m/S^2 in centripetal acceleration.
Ok, now imagine your bead is now a 1kg spaceship.  Instead of the string
pulling on the spaceship with a force of 9.8 neutons, the ship's engines
are pushing it with 9.8 neutons.  As long as the ship's nose is pointed at
the center of the circle and is accelerating at 1G, you will stay right there.

Ok now expand the scale.  Now you have a 30 meter long ship accelerating
at 1G.  Sure you'd want the diameter of the rotation to be much longer.
But you are not rotating in such a way that the center of rotation is within
the body of the ship.

Trust me it works.  (Hey you're at MIT!  I'm at Auburn!  You're supposed to
be smarter than me!) :-) :-)

BTW, it was always my impression that a Radiation counter in megatrav would
detect particulate radiation.  Thus it is useless in finding stars.  In
order for a TL 9 ship to jump, you will need some sort of telescope, and
the closest thing in MT is the Light Intensifier.

Mr. Scott
1=[(-1)^2]^1/2=(-1)^1/2*(-1)^1/2=i*i=i^2=-1

1=-1 QED

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3292
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 00:16:09 EST
From: Mike.Metlay@ORGAN.MUSIC.CS.CMU.EDU
Subject: Just when you thought it was safe to read the TML again!


PART 7

Terra: The AECO Starport

	"RUN, DAMMIT!"
	"Can't--<huff>--keep up!"
	"Come ON! We're DEAD if we slow down now!"
	The running footsteps echoed in the long tunnel, splashing water in 
the dim light from the coldlamps hanging in the air like a mist of silver.
Faint and far away, a strange sound was heard for the barest instant, like a 
sudden roll of thunder.
	<whoom>
	"What was THAT, f'Godsakes?!"
	"I dunno! RUN!"
	There was a splash and a curse, as a body went sprawling in the 
water. In a final disgusting indignity, the puddle was sticky and warm to
the touch....the sound reverberated in the tunnel again, louder this time.
	<Whooom>
	"Get UP, damn yer ass!"
	"What the hell IS that!"
	"Who cares! RUN!"
	Echoing footsteps, light after light passing by overhead in an 
endless stream. Again, the sound. And again, louder still.
	<WHOOOOM>
	"THERE!" Grant skidded to a stop, nearly bowled over from behind
by the others. He pointed at a dim shadow, barely visible on the ceiling
in the darkness between the ill-spaced lights. 
	"Access hatch," he panted. "Kherk! Footstool!"
	The huge Vargr hunched down in the corridor, and Sanchez scrambled
onto his back. Fell and Jaeger steadied his legs as he reached up above his
head and began to work at the lock....
	<WHOOOOMMMM!>
	"What the hell is that NOISE?!" Fell threw a glance over his 
shoulder. "It keeps getting louder...."
	Jaeger stiffened suddenly. "Oh, no," he muttered. "They wouldn't.
Not even the SOLOMANI would stoop that low!" He shuddered quietly to himself. 
	"What? WHAT?!"
	"They're blasting the tunnels in sequence with live steam from the
main fusion plant," Jaeger gritted. "They mean to boil us alive."
	"Hey, HOLD STILL!" Sanchez teetered for a dangerous moment, then 
recovered himself. "Trying to WORK up here!"
	<WHOOOOOOMMMMMMMM!>
	"Sorry," Kherkhoulloth muttered, trying to still his shivering.
"Boiled alive," he whispered softly. 
	"Straight out of a Fleming novel," Jaeger sighed. "What a positively
TACKY way to die...."
	"Tacky." Fell seemed to be desperately trying not to laugh. Or maybe
scream.... "Tacky." He sighed. "Well, SORRY, Jaeger. These things--"
	<WHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMM!!>
	"--happen." 
	"I FELT that one." Grant touched the curving wall. "In the rock...."
	"GOT IT!" Kherkhoulloth rolled to the side as the access valve
clanged open and Sanchez rode the retractable ladder from the open access
tube down to the floor. He swarmed up the ladder again, panting, "Gotta get
the upper hatch, now...." 
	"Go! Don't wait for him! GO!" Grant hustled Fell and Jaeger up the 
ladder after Sanchez.
	"You next, chief," Kherkhoulloth rumbled. "I can take the heat on my
fur better than you can." 
	"Kherk--" Grant was cut off by the rumbling roar of steam, deafening 
now. Chips of plaster fluttered down from the ceiling. 
	"That one was right next door, we're NEXT! Don't argue!" 
	Grant went up the ladder, three rungs at a time. Kherkhoulloth
hurried after him, pausing in the narrow hatchway to reach down and begin
hauling the ladder back up. Three pulls, four.... 
	The ladder jammed.
	Growling angrily, Kherkhoulloth reached down out of the access hatch
and grabbed the ladder's lowest rung. In doing so, he had to poke his muzzle
and head back down into the corridor. "I must look like an idiot," he
snarled. Upside down in a narrow tube, hauling on a stuck-- 
	His eyes widened. A boiling wall of flame was hurtling down the
tunnel toward him. The crash and roar was earsplitting. With a howl of sheer
terror, Kherkoulloth let go of the ladder and grabbed the hatch, hauling
upward with all his might. It hit the ladder with a clang, jarring it loose,
and slammed shut just as the dim tunnel suddenly turned hellishly bright.... 
	Kherkoulloth wasn't brave, but Tsogukh was. And if there was one 
thing an Urzaeng Vargr did well, it was enduring pain stoically. He hung 
upside down for a long minute, muscles straining against the slipstream that
was trying to haul the hatch open and suck him into the boiling maelstrom
below, gritting his teeth and whimpering softly as the hatch handle grew 
warm, then hot, then scalding....
	And then it was over. There was only quiet below him. Gently he 
turned the hatch handle a half turn, hissing as the skin peeled away from
his hand. Gingerly he let it go. It held.
	He resisted the urge to faint, forced himself around in the narrow
tube, and began to climb the ladder, hind legs slipping on the rungs, burned
hand clutched to his chest. There was light above him, and a breeze....
	And then they were hauling him out of the vent shaft and easing him 
down onto the hard concrete floor. "You okay, buddy?"
	"I burned my hand," Kherkhoulloth whimpered. "See?" He held the
wounded hand up for the others to inspect. 
	Fell whistled as he gently turned the Vargr's hand from side to side.
"Second-degree burns for sure," he said. "You got pretty cooked, furball."
He grinned. "But compared to us ALL getting parboiled, I'd say that was a
pretty good tradeoff."
	"You would." Kherkhoulloth began licking the wounded hand gingerly.
	"Where are we, anyway?" Fell looked about him with interest. The
wall in which the access tube was set was an interior one, and the ceiling
was high and dimly lit in the stifling heat. The tube opening was well hidden
behind piles of crates, grouped to allow easy access with grav lifters.
	"Storehouse for offshipped items, I'd guess," Jaeger ventured, 
examining a crate's shipping label. "Pah," he muttered disgustedly. "All
computer coded. Nothing to read. Why didn't we keep Hector with us?"
	"Because they know we have him," Sanchez sighed. "He can travel 
faster on his own, and meet us when we get the hell out of here." He fumbled 
through the pouch at his waist. "Nope, no code reader," he shrugged. "I guess 
the guy I slugged wasn't a stevedore...."
	His voice trailed off at the sound of whistling. Someone was coming 
down one of the aisles.
	Jaeger smiled wickedly. "Methinks I have an idea, gentlesophonts."

	"Ah, 'scuse me a moment!"
	The Transshipment Inspector turned around at the unfamiliar voice.
He saw a somewhat unkempt man in a TI uniform striding toward him across the 
cargo dock. The new arrival was obviously a senior bureaucrat of some kind, 
the Inspector thought with an inward sigh. He carried himself with that 
certain air of arrogance that officials in positions of power tend to 
develop, and he was having a terrible time staying out from under the cargo 
haulers as they rapidly unloaded crates from the AECO monorail cars.
	The Inspector saluted smartly. "What can I do for you, sir?"
	"I'm ah, really sorry to disturb you, Mister," the bureaucrat said
in an gravelly snarl, "But my partner and I--" He flicked a thumb over his 
shoulder at another man in a TI uniform, poking about the crates with a code 
reader, "--are looking for a mixup in the AECO shipping register for this 
run." He leaned closer to the Inspector. "Probably nothing, but YOU know what
it's like dealing with The New Boss, right?"
	The Inspector's carefully neutral look faded to a small frown. "Watch 
what you're saying, friend," he said mildly. "You KNOW they could be 
monitoring us, right?"
	"Yah, sure," the official grinned, shrugging. "But who cares?" He 
bellowed at the ceiling, "IF THEY'D LET US DO OUR JOBS!" --his voice returned 
to its previous growl. "--We'd have a lot less to worry about."
	The Inspector gulped audibly.
	"Here's the problem," the official said, handing a codesheet to the 
Inspector. "There's been a shipment of carbon film, YOU know, for fusion 
cleanup crews, that's gotten mixed up with a shipment of CARTON film, the 
stuff you wrap around piles of crates to keep'em on the dolly, you know?"
He gave the Inpsector a playful dig in the shoulder. "Simple mixup with the
parser, probably, but you can't be sure, so me and the guy in Moscow are 
busy trying to make sure the right shipment went to the right place, see?"
	"Ah." The Inspector nodded, and retrieved a code probe from his shirt 
pocket. He ran the probe over the sheet. "Hmm. That'd be over here, in the
stuff I haven't inspected yet." He pointed down the tube toward the tail of 
the monorail. "I'm not supposed to skip over any part of the shipment, but 
this doesn't look like it'll take more than a minute...."
	"Great. I appreciate it. I'll mention how helpful you were to your
supervisor...." The official wandered down the bustling dock beside the 
Inspector. Behind him, his partner walked quickly up to a pile of crates
that was being readied for inspection by a stevedore in a cargo lifter, 
and cleared his throat loudly.
	"Yah? So whatchawant?" The stevedore leaned out of the lifter's cab, 
chewing on a narco and looking over the official doubtfully.
	"We could use a hand with a quick inspection check, friend," the 
official said mildly. "My partner over there is with your supervisor, 
preparing to crosscheck codes on a shipment that may have been misdirected. 
Would you mind giving them a hand?"
	"I got crates ta move," the stevedore said surlily.
	"Very well," the official shrugged. "I shall find someone more 
willing to help his superiors when a crisis arises." He turned away.
	"Waitaminnit!" The stevedore spat out his narco and gunned the
lifter. "I'm goin', I'm goin'. Sheez! Humpin' bureaucrats...."
	The second official watched him go, a small smile on his lips. He
nonchalantly reached down to the customs tag on one of the crates the
stevedore had been about to lift and stack, and yanked it off with a snap.
	"Go," he whispered.
	The lid of the crate opened, and Grant, Kherkhoulloth, and Sanchez
staggered out clumsily. "What a ride," Sanchez managed, as he and the others
slumped down behind a stack of crates, out of sight of the stevedore. Quickly
the official attached a new tag to the crate, and looked up nonchalantly as
his partner returned with the Inspector.
	"Well?"
	"All clear," was the reply. "Damn stevedore had the crate we wanted
on the bottom of the stack, but I was able to do a spot check by lot number.
Looks like the parser did okay, so they're NOT gonna get carton film at the
Moscow Power Authority!"
	The Inspector chuckled. "Thank heavens for that. All we'd need was 
another scandal for the monit--" His mouth snapped shut. "You know," he 
mumbled lamely.
	"Uh-huh," the first official said soothingly. "Thanks for 
everything." He and his partner walked smartly away toward the exit. The 
Inspector watched them go, shaking his head. Then he returned his attention
to the crates....

	"I never never NEVER wanna do that again," Kherkhoulloth muttered
as the group, mingling with the crowds, made its way out into the glaring 
sun. "What a RIDE! Even WITHOUT Sanchez throwing up."
	"That's unnecessary," Sanchez snapped uncharacteristically. "When 
one has been (a) interrogated (b) starved (c) subjected to severe physical
and emotional--" He stopped. "Whoops," he smiled sheepishly. "Seems like
there's still a little Newton left rattling around in here." He clapped a 
palm to an ear several times, as if knocking water from the other ear.
	"Well, of COURSE there is," Fell said irritably as he stuffed the
official's uniform into a trash bin. "He's mostly YOU, isn't he? Just a
set of fake memories and habits spliced onto your old training. Like 
Tchorgin, or Newton, or...." 
	His voice changed tone suddenly. "AL-JEET!" He began pushing to the 
edge of the air/raft ramp, waving. The others followed him, mystified.
	"Aljeet?" Sanchez scratched his head. "What does--"
	A battered, rattling old air/raft swerved out of the neat lines
of vehicles at the monorail station entry, nearly causing a number of 
accidents. Other drivers leaned out of their cabs and shook their fists
at the cab as its gull-wing doors swung upward to admit the party.
	"HEEYIKE!" Kherkhoulloth yanked the door shut behind him with his 
good hand as the raft rocketed upward, heeling over on one side like a
starfighter. "ARE YOU CRAZY?!"
	Fell rattled off a few quick words in Arabic to the driver, who 
grinned through rotten teeth, sang, "Kham, effendi!" and sent the raft 
shooting across the desert toward the distant towers of Cairo.
	"Do ALL taxi drivers in Egypt go hell bent for leather like this?"
Grant frantically struggled with his seat restraints, trying to strap 
himself in as the raft lurched and stalled, dropping a hundred meters
before it recovered its lift.
	"Of course not, Captain," Fell grinned. "Only the ones who take 
inordinate risks delivering passengers without allowing them to be picked
up by SolSec monitors-- at a price, of course." The driver nodded, grinning.
	"But how could he--ah!" Jaeger nodded understanding. "A code word!"
	"Al-Jitni," Fell nodded. "Jitney. Unregistered hired transport."
He spoke a few more words to the driver, who nodded, his dark face suddenly
serious. The raft swooped downward to one of the Cairo arcology towers, its
vast expanse of terraces and windows looming huge before them.
	"Are we gonna HIT?" Sanchez looked ready to vomit again.
	"Be ready to bail out," Fell barked, popping his seat restraints.

	"I don't care WHAT your supervisor says," the young woman sobbed 
tearfully as she blew her nose on her napkin. "It's our ANNIVERSARY! You
can't just go packing off to, to," She blew her nose with a honk, "To 
CLEVELAND for a week!"
	"Sweetheart," her husband sighed, pouring another cup of coffee,
"If I thought I could ask for a delay, I WOULD have! But I just don't know
if he'd let me get away with it. If I had some sort of sign--"
	His voice was cut off by a shrill scream from his wife. Like a 
breaching whale, a creaking old air/raft had risen to the level of their
balcony, close enough to touch.
	It unceremoniously tilted to one side, a door opening and dumping 
an odd assortment of people onto the balcony next to the tea table. Four 
humans and a Vargr. A HUGE Vargr, at that.
	"Beg pardon." A tall, sharp-faced man tipped an imaginary hat to 
the couple as he made his way inside. The portly fellow in the lead didn't
even speak to them.
	"Sorry about this," said the pale blonde man as he ushered the Vargr
through the door. 
	"We really must drop in again," said the foppish-looking youngster
who was last through the door. The husband leaped to his feet and charged 
after them, but they had already gone out the front door of the apartment.
	He turned around and looked at his wife, who was staring in shock at
the rapidly-fading outline of the air/raft as it streaked toward the horizon,
three SolSec speeders in hot pursuit.
	"I'll call my supervisor," he whispered. "Now."

TO BE CONTINUED



------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3293
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 00:23:46 EST
From: Mike.Metlay@ORGAN.MUSIC.CS.CMU.EDU
Subject: Edmund's Looking for ME?! AAAGH! I'M NOT HERE! Er....


.....no, I guess that wouldn't work, would it? *sigh*

Adam, my Email address is metlay@organ.music.cs.cmu.edu. I could probably
make a stab at answering about 2/3 of the questions you ask, and give 
CORRECT answers on about 3/4 of those, but I'm in Oak Ridge right now
preparing to run an experiment and my mail time is limited. Still, it
can't hurt to ask, so send me your questions. 

(We should have a sign up system so everyone gets to answer one question
of Adam's.... |->

metlay

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3294
From: d9bertil@dtek.chalmers.se
Subject: An E-tribe called TML
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 13:16:44 MET

  I hope nobody takes offence about the subject, because that issue of
Scientific American that I never quit talking about used the word 'tribe' to
describe small (up to a few hundred) electronic group that "support sustained
interaction, develop their own norms of behaviour and generate peer pressure":)

  In the best of traditions from Monte Python, I'll not talk about that, but
about the feasability of doing some serious Traveller work over the TML with
regards to how electronic groups work.

  There has been laboratory studies of how different electronic forums perform
in comparision to face-to-face meetings and even, belive it or not, studies
of the frequencey of flames in different forums.

  The results were that in discussions done through electronic mail there are
less 'stool pigeons' than in fact-to-face discussions. More ideas were
proposed in them, but they took *much* longer to reach a decision. From the
diagrams they took between three and five times as long time to get something
done.

  I belive that we have seen this in action at least once, and that was one
of the reasons behind why I said that unless a core group of persons in
physical contact with each other is placed as the spiders in the net, there
is no way anything comm*rcially successful will come out of TML.

  (Also note that I have a nagging suspicion that the site that most graciously
lends their resources to serve as the hub of the TML would object rather
strongly if anything comm*rcially successful came out of the TML)

- -bertil-
- -- 
"It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or
 strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an
 exercise for your kill-file."

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3295
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 11:17:45 GMT-0600
From: bonnevil@stolaf.edu
Subject: Re: Misc. Questions...


just a couple tidbits that grabbed my attn. -- some of us are supposed to
be working on final projects, not reading mail! :)

On Imperial Colleges:  My opinion is that the Educ increases that we've seen
    in the recent rules for College indicates a liberal-arts style emphasis
    in Imperial education.  The varied courses or whatever the students do
    results in a broad range of knowlege that can best be simulated by an
    increase in the Educ score rather than any particular skills.  Somehow
    it makes sense that IISS Admin would want highly educated officers to
    supervise what must be an insanely complex service, involving a rich
    knowlege about Known Space, how to learn, how to understand a new
    culture, the history of technology, of Imperial philosophy....  It also
    helps explain the initial IISS neutrality in the Rebellion.

    However, I have also used an alternative system which is little-known
    and dates to the 1977 Traveller rules.  Any character may take four
    years off for "college", at a cost of Cr70000.  Instead of the Educ bonus,
    the character may take EITHER one level-two skill OR two level-one skills.
    The player is allowed to select ANY SKILL or skills.  This isn't 
    necessarily a college, but simply someplace the skill could be learned.
    (I can't imagine learning just Equestrian-2 at college, but you never
    know.... :) )  If College is done as part of generation, I usually waive
    the fee. (Although it might be interesting to have a young character
    with some nasty college loans! :) again!)

On Credit:  I don't think the Imperium operates on an interstellar credit
    system like ours.  Travel time would make collecting payments (or for
    that matter, reciepts!) a bit dicey.  Didn't an old JTAS have an article
    about Imperial and megacorp sponsored debit cards?  The debit cards are
    very similar in appearance to credit cards, except that they are 
    encoded with a specific balance in credits at the bank, and transactions
    are encoded on them.  Data encryption security for those are even
    tighter than a starship's black box -- it takes some hellish levels of
    Computer, Electronics, and Forgery to rig one up.  If the bank decides
    to audit your card, it can take up to seven years to get all the 
    transactions verified by xboat!
 

- -- Steve

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3296
Subject: Re: (3288) Re: General Traveller Questions 
From: TML Administrator <traveller-request@metolius.WR.TEK.COM>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 10:03:06 PST


Adam Naylor <anaylor@gara.une.oz.au> writes:
> 2) College: ...
> How about instead of gaining educ points, gain levels of academic.  So a
> character could have studied history, or genetics or something like that at
> college.

Sounds cool!

> 3) Flight School : Is this one year or 4.

I think it's 1 year.

> 4) Traveller Aid Society.  The description in the book isnt all that
> clear... Do travellers members pay for accomodation while travelling, How
> do they prove thier identity as a traveller member.

It's not clear to me either.  Make a ruling.  I'd allow TAS members get
free basic lodging and food at TAS hotels.  Shipboard it's part of the
High Passage.

> 5) Naval Bases and Scout Bases

> How big is a naval base (very roughly, like how many ships etc)

For naval base size, one might want to go back to the Trillion Credit
Squadron game to get an idea.  Scout base is anyone's guess, although I
think there are some published adventures with example scout bases.

> Do the staff at bases count as members of the population

No.

> 8) What exactly are the official guidelines for vehicle creation.  It
> seemed that all the creators in the archives (well the bundles) had thier
> own idea

That's right.  The "official" guidelines are in the 3 boxed MT books of
wisdom. :-)

> 10) What is mike metlay (???)'s email address.  I would like to ask him a
> few questions?????

metlay@organ.music.cs.cmu.edu

James
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Traveller Mailing List Administrator	     James T Perkins @ Tektronix, Inc
traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com	     Beaverton, Oregon, USA
    "How many ancients can dance on the head of a pin?" - Scott Kellogg

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3297
Subject: Re: Traveller (Again but not for long) 
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 10:55:03 PST
From: James T Perkins <jamesp@metolius.WR>


Adam Naylor <anaylor@gara.une.oz.au> writes:
> Do you mean you ingnore extended system generation????  As in dont worry
> about what sun it has etc.

Well, not exactly.  Usually my systems are first generated with the
basic generation (mainworld only).  Eventually later I shoehorn that
mainworld into an extended system generation.

> So what exactly is a strike assignment, and siege and so forth

I can't help!  I'm have no military experience and I don't remember seeing
any clear definitions.

> Well I emailed Rob Dean, and I guess he heard I was coming <sigh> so he
> didnt reply.

Sigh.

> Like I am really sorry about disturbing you.  I dont suppose you have any
> info on the supposed new traveller (ie the bug free baby)

The only info I have is from GEnie, forwarded to the TML archives.  The
only really concrete thing is that they are replacing the 2d6 task
system with a d20 task system, that it is set in about TI 1195, that a
computer virus has contributed to the fall of the Imperium.  I know that
as far as game mechanics go, there are no sacred cows.  I suspect the
history of the imperium will be unscathed, but the mechanics will be
derived from Twilight 2000 in part and MT in part.

> By the way is there anyway I can view the traveller newsgroup without
> having to subcribe.  eg to look at rec.games.frp I type vn -n rec.games.frp

No, there is no TML newsgroup, nor does the TML want there to be a TML
newsgroup.  You MUST either subscribe via direct mail or have a site
administrator gateway the incoming mail into a local newsgroup.

James
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Traveller Mailing List Administrator	     James T Perkins @ Tektronix, Inc
traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com	     Beaverton, Oregon, USA
    "How many ancients can dance on the head of a pin?" - Scott Kellogg

------------------------------

Archive-Message-Number: 3298
Subject: TML Admin Deluged
From: TML Administrator <traveller-request@metolius.WR.TEK.COM>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 91 11:35:10 PST


For some people of late I have been very responsive, for others I have
been UNresponsive.  Particularly those asking me about MSDOS floppy TML
archives.  Well, I'm going to plead schedule pressure and keep you
waiting even longer.  YOU AREN'T BEING PERMANENTLY IGNORED, JUST
TEMPORARILY! I hope to unbury myself before the end of January...

James
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Traveller Mailing List Administrator	     James T Perkins @ Tektronix, Inc
traveller-request@metolius.wr.tek.com	     Beaverton, Oregon, USA
    "How many ancients can dance on the head of a pin?" - Scott Kellogg

------------------------------

End of TML Bundle
*****************

